GrodsCorp

GrodsPoll — The Beatles: Hot or Not?

Monday 31 March 2008, 3:12 pm

The Editor

Categories: GrodsPoll, Music

Tags: DanielJohns, Lennon/McCartney, Silverchair, TheBeatles

A debate (of sorts, because yelling “YOU’RE SHIT!” at each other isn’t a debate) has been raging in another comment thread about The Beatles. It all started when the work of Lennon/McCartney was unfavourably compared to the work of Silverchair’s Daniel Johns. So let’s set the record straight.

The Beatles: Hot or Not?

Poll closes COB Wednesday.

UPDATE (4.45pm): Bron has pointed out in comments that she’d like to vote ‘hot’ and ‘not’ based on old stuff/new stuff thinking. I’ve added this option to the poll for others who are facing the same conundrum.

131 Comments

keri (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:33 pm) #

I stand by my argument - Beatles = mediocre, talentless shite.

Come on people! Stand up for those of us with good taste!

And I’m appealing to you, Ed, to include the “Who are the Beatles” votes in “Not” as if people don’t know who the Beatles are, they can hardly be classified as “Hot”, can they?
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:33 pm) #

That this has come to a poll is a scandal of the highest order.
The Editor (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:34 pm) #

For the record, I voted “hot”.
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:35 pm) #

Keri, Keri, Keri. I hate to channel The Boltard, but please: name three bands that you consider more talented than The Beatles.
Terry Wright (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:37 pm) #

LOL fucking LOL … a poll.

Very good Ant.
Terry Wright (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:41 pm) #

“LOL fucking LOL a poll”
Hey, I’m a poet and I don’t even realise it … that I know it … I am … a er a poet.

See.
Chuck A. Spear (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:42 pm) #

You should write lyrics for Johns Terry.
keri (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:42 pm) #

Ant, I’d have trouble finding three bands that were less talented musically.

But how about, for a start, and this is going to be contentious in and of itself, Interpol, Cake and Catatonia?
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:43 pm) #

Oh dear.
Chuck A. Spear (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:44 pm) #

I think The Tin Lids, Pugwall and the Orange Organics and The Zit Remedy are far superior to that lot Keri.
bron (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:45 pm) #

Help! Stuck in some strange town called “Brisbane”, anyone heard of it? There are strange creatures crawling all over the place; I’m told they are called “human beings”. What would I do without my phone to tell you of this amazing discovery? Anyway re this poll (sorry, Mr The, I can’t make new paragraph from my mobile phone) I can’t choose any of those alternative answers because The Beatles were both “hot” and “not”. That is, early stuff: shit; later stuff: trippin’ (thus hot).
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:49 pm) #

I once had a heated argument with my brother and a mate of his (in about 1989) about whether New Kids on the Block were better than The Beatles and were going to stand the test of time. They were dead serious, too.

I think it’s fair to say that my brother and his mate were vindicated.
keri (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:49 pm) #

That’s fine, Chuck, but I would still argue that they are superior musically to The Beatles.

Anyway, Ant. I have yet to hear you utter one word in defence of the Beatles that indicates they had any actual talent.
Bridgit Gread (Monday 31 March 2008, 3:59 pm) #

Hey, I’m a poet and I don’t even realise it … that I know it … I am … a er a poet.

Doctor Terrytong?
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:00 pm) #

I can’t believe I have to point this out, Keri, but here it is: in 1967, Sgt Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band blew the lid off popular music, paving the way for just about everything else that’s ever followed. Even people who don’t rate The Beatles as personal favourites seem comfortable with this as a statement of fact.

That album itself has dated, but I defy anyone to listen to tracks like “Happiness is a Warm Gun” (White Album) or Abbey Road in its entirety and tell me these songs still don’t sound thoroughly modern.

The Beatles were masters of melody, and not just in an innovative sense; John Lennon can be credited with changing the face of pop-music lyricism; and thanks to George Martin, several of The Beatles’ arrangements still stand up today as some of pop music’s finest.

And that’s just a start. Talentless! Jesus wept.
bron (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:01 pm) #

Thanks for the late addition. Since The Beatles were half n half, that indicates that there were better bands in the 60s/70s. The Rolling Stones, Led Zep, The Doors, CSN&Y, Deep Purple and so on. Rock on, I’m so cool. Screw this text messaging, my hand is aching. Ooer, missus.
The Editor (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:03 pm) #

You can connect a telephone to the intertubes? How do you do it? String?
Bridgit Gread (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:05 pm) #

Anyway, Ant. I have yet to hear you utter one word in defence of the Beatles that indicates they had any actual talent.

If Ant won’t then I will, since there’s some downtime at work.

Their individual talent was marginal but together they were prepared to break out of the jingly-jangly three-chord stereotype that stank up early 60s pop music like a dead flounder. That’s what made them great: their capacity to experiment, adapt and not just blindly copy others or fall into a sad parody of their first album. Sir George Martin had a bit to do with this; so did copious amounts of drugs. But they did it nonetheless.

I agree that their early stuff (’Love Me Do’, ‘She Loves You’, etc.) was crap but it’s their later work that defines them. You can’t listen to Abbey Road or Sergeant Pepper and not think that either was revolutionary.
Ted (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:05 pm) #

The Beatles were a band at the right place at the right time. And to set the record straight, whether they were a great/the best band or not is realy irrelevant. People like what they like and that’s all that matters. If we didn’t, we wouldn’t be individuals.
Bridgit Gread (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:07 pm) #

Ant and I just said similar things. Groupthinking fuckers we are.
The Editor (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:09 pm) #

People like what they like and that’s all that matters. If we didn’t, we wouldn’t be individuals.

We’re not into individualism around here, Ted.
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:09 pm) #

I agree with what most of Bridgit says, except that their individual talent was marginal. They wrote very few songs in strict colaboration, and Lennon, McCartney and even Harrison recorded many fine songs once The Beatles disbanded.
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:12 pm) #

… whether they were a great/the best band or not is realy irrelevant.

Ted, this discussion started because Keri stated The Beatles were “shit” and devoid of talent. Of course it would be foolish to argue about whether they were (or are) “the best band”, but we’re just setting the record straight with regards to their talent and significance.
Bridgit Gread (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:14 pm) #

The point I was making was that their collective talent went far beyond the sum of their individual talents. Lennon aside, most would agree they had individual careers of only mediocre success. And you’re right about their rather limited collaboration, that was where George Martin came into it: he was the glue that stuck all their fragmented paper dollies together.
Chuck A. Spear (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:19 pm) #

Yep and if the wig wearing, gun toting, psycho Phil Spector hadn’t have made Let It Be sound like it was recorded at the same time as Do Run Run then it may have ended on a better note.

George Martin is OK. His son however, is a cunt.
Terry Wright (Monday 31 March 2008, 4:40 pm) #

I used to think the early stuff was shite too. I personally don’t like it much but musically it is still spot on. The Beatles are the most talented musicians ever to be in a group. It may sound simple but do you ever wonder why cover bands just can’t get the same ‘feel’. The Beatles were masters of dischords. I thought Steely Dan were the most complex music to play but the Beatles were extreme. They could not write a song without the most complex chord groupings possible. It gave the songs incredible depth and hence the longevity to their music.

As a fellow muso once said, “you can’t play their songs slow”. If you do, it sounds like random chords with a melody in the wrong key. If you simplified the chords it looses that unique depth and becomes boring.

P Mac is without doubt the most creative and amazing bass player ever. George and John are so comfortable with their own guitar playing they change chords nearly every beat, like a jazz guitarist. Ringo is the let down. Technically he is just average but a perfect fit for such a unique combination.

I could go on but you get the drift. They had enormous musical depth and the Lennon-McCartney combo was like 2 sides of one brain. Sharp vs melodic.

BTW. They were all heroin addicts at one time or another.
Terry Wright (Monday 31 March 2008, 5:27 pm) #

It all started when the work of Lennon/McCartney was unfavourably compared to the work of Silverchair’s Daniel Johns. So let’s set the record straight.

I didn’t compare the two. Lennon/McCartney are geniuses and I happen to like their music. Daniel Johns … I just like his music.
The Editor (Monday 31 March 2008, 6:35 pm) #

Sorry, Terry. Too busy laughing to take this debate seriously. It’s cracking me up.
Spock... (Monday 31 March 2008, 7:00 pm) #

Even people who don’t rate The Beatles as personal favourites seem comfortable with this as a statement of fact.

I actually have never seen an argument contrary to this. And with good cause.

They are incredibly talented musicians but the individual talents of the members is irrelevant because the best bands are far more then the sum of their parts.

Their influence on all pop music that followed can not be denied.

The constant pushing of boundaries and studio creativity is just remarkable. Pop/rock music owes everything to the Beatles.

The first 8 track recording that is A Day In The Life. The orchestration and melody of Strawberry Fields. The tape loops and drone of Tomorrow Never Knows. And the whole Revolver album is pretty much the blue print for any indie rock/pop band of the bast 2 decades.

I could go on… But there is so much that the Beatles did that has influenced and continues to influence music today.

If they had not existed, music would be very different right now.
Chuck A. Spear (Monday 31 March 2008, 7:03 pm) #

Terry has created a monster Ed.
Leon Bertrand (Monday 31 March 2008, 7:34 pm) #

Most people here admire the Beatles, and on this one I would have to agree.

Abbey Road and Let It Be were simply masterpieces. And the number of great singles the Beatles pumped out with every album definitely makes them one of the best bands ever.

Daniel Johns is good, but I don’t like that Straight Lines song and I don’t think he’s quite in the same league.
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 7:39 pm) #

I disagree with you about Let It Be, Leon — it took Phil Spector to salvage those sessions as an album, and even then I think the result, overall, still tells the tale of the disharmony in the studio and the unhappiness of the band’s members.

I very much agree about Abbey Road though. I even love the much-maligned “Maxwell’s Silver Hammer”!
THR (Monday 31 March 2008, 8:01 pm) #

Nothing better than Rubber Soul for when you want to get toasted. Nicely toasted.
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 8:15 pm) #

Amen to that.
Ray Dixon (Monday 31 March 2008, 8:39 pm) #

Anyone who does not appreciate the Beatles’ greatness, originality and musical superiority simply knows nothing about music. Comparing bands like Silverchair is just absurd.

The Beatles broke up in 1970 after less than a decade in the business and their music still stands the test of time - even the earlier light ‘pop’ stuff.

It’s hard to “imagine” how music would have evolved without the Beatles. I doubt, for instance, The Stones would have been anything than just another local band. The Beatles broke the ground and they were still breaking it when they wound up. They were just light years ahead of anyone else.

Incidentally, believe it or not, the only band that has come close to replicating Beatles music in the past 40 years has been Crowded House - although they didn’t have the breadth of works.

This is a non-argument; it’s like asking “Was Nelson Mandella the greatest indivivdual of the 20th century”. Answer = by a street.
Terry Wright (Monday 31 March 2008, 8:49 pm) #

Ever listened Abbey Road smoking grass?

I swear I could see the bass notes. It is full of tiny background noises and sub melodies that make the perfect fodder for a mind on marijuana.

Oh Darling! becomes an aggressive portrayal of wife beating, I Want You is of course, John’s experience on smack and it becomes extremely evil, The End is well … the end of everything. Really mind bending stuff. Even Maxwell’s Silver Hammer takes on a new sinister twist.

Although I don’t smoke the weed anymore, the last time I can remember was about 7-8 years ago by myself, lights off and Abbey Road. So hippy hippy shake but still incredible.
THR (Monday 31 March 2008, 8:50 pm) #

This is a non-argument; it’s like asking “Was Nelson Mandella the greatest indivivdual of the 20th century”. Answer = by a street.

Come on - surely General Franco/Silverchair come close?
Old Timer (Monday 31 March 2008, 9:08 pm) #

Hot, then and now.
John Surname (Monday 31 March 2008, 9:37 pm) #

Hot.

But Let It Be is rubbish.
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 10:04 pm) #

… the only band that has come close to replicating Beatles music in the past 40 years has been Crowded House …

Ray, I’ve suggested that at parties and just about had to duck punches. But I think you’re absolutely right — particularly in the Woodface period, where Neil and Tim were writing together.
Wah (Monday 31 March 2008, 10:21 pm) #

I can’t beleive this debate has been allowed to go on.

Of course the Beatles had fucking talent! They wrote some of the most enduring songs in musical history often without the luxury of having influences, unlike the myriad of bands who have been influenced by them (ripped them off).

To compare the Beatles to Daniel Johns is like -comparing:

-Hilter with Saddam Hussein
-World War II with Gulf War II (Operation Freedom)
-John Curtin and Kevin Rudd
-Sophia Loren and Nicole Kidman
-Steaming piece of shit and Nicole Kidman
-Bobby Darrin and Michael Buble
-Alex Jesaulenko and Brendon Fevola

The trouble with young people is they assume that anything that existed before they started polluting the world, with their fetid Gen Y presence, simply wasn’t good - until of course a song is sampled or covered or made a movie of. Johnny Cash is a great example.

And Ant, if your brother seriously debated that New Kids on the Block were better than The Beatles then you, as a big brother, has every right to kick several layers of shit out of him.
Wah (Monday 31 March 2008, 10:23 pm) #

Oh Ant, I once had an argument with my sister who claimed Go West were bigger than Midnight Oil and would stand the test of time. I kicked several layers out of the little bitch.
Spock... (Monday 31 March 2008, 10:31 pm) #

Incidentally, I saw Silverchair twice last year. (once to see Powderfinger, and once to see Something For Kate).

The 2 worst gigs I have ever been to.

Ever.

And Powderchair Johns had obviously just got a new effect pedal and he insisted on using it in every song. The most annoying sound I have ever heard!
Spock... (Monday 31 March 2008, 10:34 pm) #

I am also reminded of an argument my dad and a friend had with another duo. The latter claimed that The Angels were better, more popular and would stand the test of time more then Simon And Garfunkel.

2 weeks later Simon And Garfunkel had their reunion concert in central park…

Kinda buried The Angles…
Ant Rogenous (Monday 31 March 2008, 10:46 pm) #

I love those arguments, Wah and Spock. And it’s the right — nay, the duty — of the person who was correct to remind the other person, at every available opportunity, how spectacularly wrong they got it. For the rest of their lives.
Terry Wright (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:13 pm) #

Crowded house? C’MON.

Beatles are brilliant. Crowded House are excellent but I have never heard anyone capture The Beatles unique style or even come close.

Also they are one of those bands that were lucky enough to have exactly the right combination of people to make a perfect fit. These bands cannot play as they were if any member left. The few I know of are Led Zeppelin & Cold Chisel. A perfect balance.

Anyone else?
THR (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:20 pm) #

No cold chisel references, please.
You lose a point for every one. Three points lost, and you’re out of the group. 5 points lost, and Mr Surname puts your esploits to song.

It’s your choice.
Ray Dixon (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:21 pm) #

Sorry Terry, if you go into the Finn Brother’s history you’ll find they were almost totally influenced by Beatles music, and it shows, esecially in Crowded House songs like “Always take the weather”. It’s Lennon/McCartney reinvened.
THR (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:27 pm) #

C’mon.
‘Leon is a nowhere man…’
Wah (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:35 pm) #

This dismissal of Cold Chisel in this thread is a typical lefty revisionist attempt to rewrite history. Chisel might not fit in to what’s hot today but they were fucking awesome. If you’re unaware of their legend simply shut the fuck up and play Rhianna.

All their albums are strong with hardly a weak song in them and they were even better live - unfortunately their brilliance has been tarnished somewhat by groups of drunk people who embrace each other to Khe Sahn and singing “the last ‘train’ (sic) out of Sydney’s almost gone” as though they themsleves took part in the Battle of Long Tan.

Crowded House was fantastic - but yes full on Beatles influences. Listen to the guitars, Now Where Getting Somewhere in particular.
Chuck A. Spear (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:39 pm) #

Rhianna is way hotter than Jimmy Barnes Wah.
THR (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:42 pm) #

I wish Cold Chisel did take part in the battle of Long Tan, and I wish they stayed there. A lesser, more over-rated Australian ensemble I cannot think of. Chisel are absolute rubbish. Three chords, put together uninventively, with even worse lyrics.
And if you start singing ‘Khe Sanh’, you will be slapped my friend…
Chuck A. Spear (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:49 pm) #

Sometimes are band a defined by their fans. And when this happens it can be hard to listen to them. For example, when I see someone wearing a leather vest over a Floyd t-shirt with hair like Prodos, I just have to switch off and not let them ruin the Floyd for me.
Chuck A. Spear (Monday 31 March 2008, 11:51 pm) #

Take 2.

Sometimes a band is defined by their fans. And when this happens it can be hard to listen to reconcile and like them. For example, when I see someone wearing a leather vest over a Floyd t-shirt with hair like Prodos, I just have to switch off and not let them ruin the Floyd for me.
Wah (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:02 am) #

I agree Spear.
Khe Sahn, which is actually a bloody good song is a victim of its own popularity. It is way overplayed and fussed about to the point of becoming a tired bogan anthem! Chisel were a lot more than that song.

P.S. I actually like Rhianna. The good thing about having kids is tha k33p u yung;) lol
THR (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:08 am) #

Anybody like Nick Cave? Will Oldham?

Are you really all from melbourne, or from colac?
THR (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:10 am) #

Not that there’s anything wrong with that…

*turns blind eye to inter-sibling relations…*
Bridgit Gread (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:40 am) #

I’m off to see Weddings Parties Anything’s last hurrah in a couple of weeks. Not in the same league as some of the other groups discussed here, of course, but a bloody good pub band in their day.
THR (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:23 am) #

WPA were a bit of an institution.

Have a good last hurrah.
Terry Wright (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 3:20 am) #

Wah is correct.

How THR can write of CC as 3 chord wonders with crappy lyrics is immoral.
CC reflected the times when they were around and Walker’s cynical description of Australia was carried by Barnes like no Australian outfit since Radio Birdman & The Saints. I went to plenty of gigs when I was younger and CC were the best live band I had seen … on par with The Kinks, Rage Against The Machine and Faith No More. The bogan CC fan type image might be scary today but that was fairly much mainstream Australia back then.

Chuck has a point THR. I won’t let 40 year old Nick Cave fans dressed all in black with eye liner and beer guts tarnish my view of Nick Cave. CC had their day and don’t deserve bagging because some people didn’t let go.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 9:02 am) #

The real pressing issue in my day was: Bros or New Kids on the Block - who are spunkier?

Sigh. Childhood. So simple.
The Editor (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 9:03 am) #

Believe it or not, I recall an argument at high school about East 17 vs. Pearl Jam.
John Surname (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 9:04 am) #

Cold Chisel are no Scandal’us. And I hate Scandal’us.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 9:06 am) #

Alrighty, alrighty, everything’s gonna be alright…

God, what a shit song that was. As I used to say in high school, East 17 SUCK SHIT!
Bridgit Gread (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 10:03 am) #

Our school was obsessed with consumerism and you were more likely to see a Coke vs. Pepsi debate than anything like this.
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:30 am) #

Bloody hell. Make one derisive comment about the Beatles and look what happens.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:32 am) #

Keri, if you’d just said you hated their music, no one would have tried to convince you to like it. The problem was that you said they were shit and had no talent — which clearly is not the case.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:34 am) #

I read a comment earlier this morning where someone wrote “Lurve me do…” and since then, I’ve had that godawful song on my mind.

I hate you all, Grodsters.
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:38 am) #

Bullshit, Ant. You all would have come out with your favourite song and done the “But how could you NOT love…”

We would have ended up in the same position, you all would have said I had no taste, I would have cracked and said they were shit. I just got us here faster.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:40 am) #

That’s a bit unfair assuming I would have had the audacity to tell you you weren’t entitled to your opinion and personal taste, Keri.

I’m an arsehole, but there’s a line!
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:40 am) #

Haha! I change my mind, don’t ban Keri. I like her logic and reason, and her ability to make Ant suffer a fair whack.
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:51 am) #

I’m going to see Queens of the Stoneage tonight, Air tomorrow night and The Smashing Pumpkins in Friday night. I will be wearing a leather vest so keep an eye out for me.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:54 am) #

*faints* Queens of the Stone Age?? Oh maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan.

I love them. Josh… *sighs dreamily*
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:56 am) #

“That’s a bit unfair assuming I would have had the audacity to tell you you weren’t entitled to your opinion and personal taste, Keri.”

And what was it you thought of the football team I support, Ant?

I didn’t say you would have said I had no right to an opinion. But you probably would have told me it was wrong.
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 11:59 am) #

I’m more a fan of their/Josh’s old stuff Bron. But yeah, they’re pretty hot.

And you used an ellipse…
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:04 pm) #

I don’t think much of Essendon, Keri, but I didn’t say they were talentless. In fact, if I wanted to replicate with Essendon what you said about The Beatles, I’d claim that they were always shit despite all the premierships they’ve won; that they were the best of a mediocre bunch of teams each time they took the flag.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:05 pm) #

And that Kevin Sheedy’s mastery as a coach for 27 years has in no way influenced other coaches throughout the AFL.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:05 pm) #

And I’d be demonstrably wrong about all that, despite my personal feelings for the club.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:06 pm) #

And you used an ellipse…

That, I did… Correctly… Not at the end of every goddamned sentence…
wayne (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:08 pm) #

were the Beatles significant? yes
were they talented ? debatable
are they as boring as bat sh%t ? HELL YEAH!
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:09 pm) #

Ouch…
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:10 pm) #

I still think QOTSA haven’t been the “same” since the little guy was kicked out (shit, his name is right there, somewhere, ummmm), the bassist. To me, he was ‘the’ QOTSA with Josh *sigh*.

Loved their earlier stuff with Kyuss. Is this where I insert \m/ ?
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:11 pm) #

Nick Oliveri. Bassist dude, kicked out of QOTSA - and life has never been the same since.
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:13 pm) #

True Bron. They need Nick back. The last good album was Songs For The Deaf. I can’t get into the last two as much. Although, I love some of the songs off the albums.

For example Era Vulgaris and Condom Full Of Wind.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:17 pm) #

I could never get sick of hearing “No One Knows”. I nearly drove my flatmate mad when it first came out, it was on high rotation in our house, then came the “Songs for the Deaf” album and she moved out shortly afterwards.*

*She’d graduated and moved back to Melbourne.
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:28 pm) #

Ant, the problem with that analogy is there’s no quantifiable way of measuring whether the Beatles were talented. I could never, and haven’t, argued that they weren’t successful - number ones alone would render my argument laughable, nor would I argue that Essendon, even in years where we dominated or won premierships, was the most talented team. It’s too subjective, and I’m hardly un-biased.

Premierships DO need a talented side though, whilst if we look at success or number one singles and albums as a means of measuring talent in music, the Spice Girls would be right up there.

And I never stated that The Beatles DIDN’T influence anyone, just that they didn’t influence anyone I’m a fan of.
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:32 pm) #

Go with the Flow is my fav of that album Bron. I love the film clip too. Your flatmate should be thanking you for playing it non stop.
Terry Wright (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:43 pm) #

I thought “Songs for the Deaf” was the first album for QOTSA?
Awesome album BTW.

I remember when Siamese Dream first came out. What an era of music! Pearl Jam’s 1st few albums, Nirvana, Alice in Chains, RHCPs, Screaming Trees, Faith No More, Bodycount’s 1st album, The Tea Party, Buffalo Tom, At The Drive-In, Beastie Boys, Weezer, Rollins, Dinosaur Jr etc.

After a decade of corporate elevator music, the guitar bands returned with a vengeance.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:45 pm) #

Is Go With the Flow the video where it’s in black and red, and lots of visual suggestions of, er, ‘entering’ a girl?!

If so, excellent clip.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:47 pm) #

No, “Rated R” was the first QOTSA album. I think. Either way, it was the one before “Songs…”.

The song “Feel Good Hit of the Summer” is the best from “Rated R”. Very easy lyrics to remember!

Nicotine, valium, vicodin, marijuana, ecstasy and alcohol.
Cocaine.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 12:59 pm) #

Keri, I give up. If you can’t accept that The Beatles’ talent is evidenced by the staggering amount of influence they’ve had not just in popular music but also in popular culture, then there’s nothing I — or anyone else — can say to convince you.

I’m happy to leave the comments in this thread to speak for themselves.
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:16 pm) #

I think it’s going to have to be one we agree to disagree on, Ant.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:17 pm) #

I don’t agree to that.*

* kidding
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:19 pm) #

*sigh* fine. Can we disagree as to agreeing, then?*

*Also kidding.
The Editor (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:24 pm) #

Don’t agree to disagree now — we’re only ~~six~~ five comments away from 100!
Mac the Wife (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:25 pm) #

Get back to poking your friends on Facebook Keri,
the adults don’t want to hear your opinions about whatever flavour-of-the-month horsehit you spend your pocket money on.
Incidentally, when did you last listen to Abbey Road, The White Album or Revolver?
You’ve clearly heard a few snippets of pre-1965 Beatles and formed an argument with all the substance and durability of a beer shit.
Oh, and you’re wrong about even the bands you like. FYI, the aural shite you’ve been gorging on is very much influenced by The Beatles, like it or not.
Genius is not dictated by sales, but a reasonable indicator is the masses of intelligent, well-informed people who bow before the brilliance of The Beatles. On the other side of the fence we have you, and your moron media-fed ilk.
Hope that clears things up for you.
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:43 pm) #

The “adults” of whom you seem to classify yourself as one have, before now, managed to conduct this discussion without resorting to personal insults, Mac the Wife. The only things approaching insults have been between Ant and myself, and we both know it’s in jest.

And “media-fed ilk”? Because Interpol, Catatonia and Cake (The bands I’ve mentioned thus far) get so much radio-play, don’t they? They’re just shoving it down my throat on Video Hits and MTV, and how can I help but swallow?

Please. If you must attack my taste in music, you might want to actually check what it is. Oh, and my age, darling.

So because I don’t follow everyone else in “bowing down to the brilliance” I am generic?

Did the logic fairy miss your house, or are you being deliberately obtuse?

And you’ve “clearly” made an assumption based on the few examples I’ve cared to cite on what I’ve heard, when I’ve heard it and how often.

And last night, because of this discussion, and on Ants recommendation, I borrowed a copy of the White Album and was unmoved.

Does that answer your questions, Mac the Wife?
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:46 pm) #

I only mentioned one song from White, Keri: Happiness is a Warm Gun.

I’d quite like to know what you thought of it, actually. Radiohead’s Thom Yorke cites it as the influence for his Paranoid Android, which is really obvious when you think about it.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:48 pm) #

Ed, what happens when we reach 100 comments? Do we get a pissweak animated gif of streamers and balloons?
The Editor (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:51 pm) #

I’m number 100!!!!1!!!11!!1!
The Editor (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:52 pm) #

Ed, what happens when we reach 100 comments? Do we get a pissweak animated gif of streamers and balloons?

I think I just answered your question.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:52 pm) #

Bastard.
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:53 pm) #

That’d be right, Ed. Ant and I do all the work, you come in and steal the glory at the last minute.

Ant, My immediate reaction was “Meh” But if it’s any consolation, Paranoid Android was always one of my least favourite Radiohead songs.

Maybe it’s a sound I’m just destined not to get?
The Editor (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 1:54 pm) #

That’d be right, Ed. Ant and I do all the work, you come in and steal the glory at the last minute.

That’s how I roll.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 2:03 pm) #

Keri, any musician that’s ever buggered around with time signatures during a pop song has Happiness is a Warm Gun to thank.

This is the kind of influence I’m getting at — this remarkable Lennon song (whether you enjoy it or not) represents one of the many ways The Beatles opened up music for everyone else that followed.

Whoops. And there I go again. I’ll zip it up now.
Terry Wright (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 2:21 pm) #

Happiness is a warm gun was the first non mainstream Beatles song I heard (and actually listened to). It changed my whole outlook on The Beatles. The song only goes for a few minutes and has 5-6 changes? I taped the White Album straight away and it blew my underpants off.

I was sick one day and had a day off from school so I borrowed the music books to play on piano. I think I managed the first few bars from 4-5 songs in a whole day … it was THAT difficult. No simple 3 finger chords - all 4 or 5 fingers with this bizarre bass lines for my left hand. Just impossible to play. My view that The Beatles were simple catchy songs changed that day forever.
Mac the Wife (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 2:24 pm) #

I’m afraid there’s no jesting where The Beatles are concerned Corey - Sorry … Keri.
And just because Rogenous doesn’t have the lead in his pencil to insult you doesn’t mean it’s not a damn fine idea.
Don’t forget, where Catatonia, Cake and Interpol are concerned, always try to spit when NME says swallow.
Smiley face to ya.
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 2:38 pm) #

Is Go With the Flow the video where it’s in black and red, and lots of visual suggestions of, er, ‘entering’ a girl?!

Yes Bron this is the one. Hot as. Also very suggestive.
Terry Wright (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 2:45 pm) #

Mac the Wife.

Why so much angst against Keri?
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 2:47 pm) #

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but information has come across my desk that Oasis will be touring in August with Ryan Adams.
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 2:52 pm) #

Adding to that:

New Kids On The Block, the original N’Sync all-boy band, will be performing together for the first time in years on April 4th, on the Today show. Yeah, that’s THIS Friday.
Terry Wright (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 2:56 pm) #

Chuck, is that Bryan Adams or Ryan Adams?
Chuck A. Spear (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 3:03 pm) #

Ryan Adams Terry. I know, I’m confused too.
Ant Rogenous (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 3:04 pm) #

Mac the Wife … Why so much angst against Keri?

Must be lead poisoning, Terry.
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 3:09 pm) #

Never read an NME in my life, Mac the Wife. And that’s despite spending my formative years in the UK. Anything you consider a lapse in good taste can only be attributed to myself, I’m afraid.

And Ant, as always, I doff my trilby in your general direction.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 3:37 pm) #

What is it about Radiohead that all the trendy groovers like?

They suck. They make The Veronicas sound good.
Bron (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 3:39 pm) #

Nice pun on “Mack the Knife”, Mac the Wife. One of my favourite Frank Sinatra choons.
kat (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 3:45 pm) #

The music = hot. The band members = not.
keri (Tuesday 1 April 2008, 3:45 pm